Will we ever....

hey all..

Does anyone here think that someday we will see a DSLR that offer both a large MP count as well as fast fps, buffer, etc??

How about a 10-12mp camera that does 8 fps with a 40 frame buffer??

Does anyone see such a camera in the near future..or is such a beast still years away??

Just curious...

Cheers,

Of course, that's just natural evolution of the media. I would expect this within 2 years.

I predict within 1 year such a camera will be at least announced. We are not that far from a 10-12 megapixel camera with 8FPS and 40 frame buffer. Not that far at all.

They might produce one in less than three years if they are willing to price it as high or higher than the 1Ds. I'd say the chances are low. Wouldn't it be more likely that you'd see 5 fps? Or that the buffer is less than 40? There is much more money to be made in the 3 fps market at this point in time.

Just my opinion...

I would like to see another qualification on this camera - that it costs less than $3000. I still think a camera that costs $8k is ridiculous.

I want to see a digital 4x5 back that is single pass, full frame, has it's own LCD display and doesn't need to be tethered to a computer. Also it has to be less than $5000. Maybe in 5 years.

- Dan

Dan Baumbach wrote:I want to see a digital 4x5 back that is single pass, full frame, has it's own LCD display and doesn't need to be tethered to a computer. Also it has to be less than $5000. Maybe in 5 years.

Don't hold your breath on that one Dan. A 300mm wafer, which this sensor will have to be built on, will cost about $3000 to manufacture. Yield at that size will be in the 10% range or worse, unless you are willing to accept dropped pixels - so that means $30,000 just for the sensor for a 4x5 before you wrap any electronics around it. And I am projecting cost learnings out 5 years. For those that don't know me, this is the business I'm in

Well,

I am not any sort of electrical wizard, but looking at the leaps and bounds in the computer industry (i.e., smaller, faster, and more powerful) why can we not see a camera that has both a large MP count AND a fast write speed?? Are there some current limits in physics that prevents this for the time being???

AMD just announced a 64bit chip for computers that is no larger than a current Intel Pentium IV chip..yet twice the power and speed..(I will not speculate on whether or not the new chip will be widely accepted)....

I guess that I will consider a D1X against a D2H when my local store gets a demo in. BTW, my local store now has 26 people on the wait list for a new D2H!!!!

Of course, I will be very anxious to see what is announced at PMA in Feb 2004....maybe the D2X (praying for an 8-10mp and at least 5fps or whatever Canon announces as the successor to the EOS-1D(s))....

Cheers,

The problem here is physical size. What the leaps and bounds have done is to allow more circuitry in the same area of silicon. For example the Canon 3MPx sensor used in the D30 and the 6MPx sensor used in the D60 are the same size and use the same amount of silicon. Miniturization is not the problem.

What Dan asked for is a FULL frame 4x5 sensor - a 4" by 5" sensor! Making something that big without a defect is extremely difficult and the yield loss, even if you project out five years. You could easily make a 100MPx full frame 35mm sized sensor within a few years if somebody wanted to invest in doing that. But making something that big and defect free is the problem.

As for AMD's 64 bit processor, 64 bit processors have been available for quite some time. This is also not a minaturization issue as much as it is a circuit design issue - how many pipes of I/O to the processor core. The Itanium and several other processors have had 64 bit pipes for years. I worked on a special application 128 bit processor in 1989 that went into production.

Hey E.J.,

Oh, I am not interested in a 100 MP DSLR ..how about at least a 10-15mp that is very fast and has a large buffer that will easily gives 60mb+ files??

So if I am reading correctly, what you are saying is that it is currently impossible to move large amounts of data in a much faster way inside a camera body?? Is that why we are seeing lower MP (but faster) DSLRs as well as large MP (but way slower) DSLRs??

I really hope that we do not have to wait years to see the technology finally allow both a super fast camera that also has large MP counts (along with a very generous buffer)....

Cheers,

When a DSLR has the image quality of a Velvia, Reala or Etktachrome G 100, the abilities of an F100, sells for the price of an F100, and an EASY and RELIABLE way of backing up years and years of treasured images is available, I will probably switch to digital. How long will that be? Within 5 years I would think.

Paul wrote:When a DSLR has the image quality of a Velvia, Reala or Ektachrome G 100, the abilities of an F100, sells for the price of an F100, and an EASY and RELIABLE way of backing up years and years of treasured images is available, I will probably switch to digital. How long will that be? Within 5 years I would think.

I think we are getting close with the Digital Rebel at $899 although there are other costs like flash cards or computer upgrades. Although, if you are scanning slides, your computer requirements are similar and the cost of a scanner has to be added into the equation.

Image quality, in my personal opinion of any 6MPx camera surpasses any 35mm slide film due to the extra exposure latitude. Yes the slide has more information, but the narrow exposure latitude and only a 4 to 5 stop dynamic range on slide film makes the image quality worse to my eyes. Reala print is probably still better than any digital camera.

As far as abilities, that is very subjective, any 35mm or DSLR has the ability to take the same picture in the hands of a skilled operator, how you achieve it is another thing. Certainly, the F100 has many more conveniences than the digital rebel.

Safe and reliable backup - I'm not sure that multiple drives, mirrored and backed up is any safer than a drawer full of slides. Either is gone in a fire. However, digital storage is certainly much more expensive.

So its all pretty subjective. But I do know that most digital holdouts, when they do start using a DSLR wonder why they didn't do it sooner and pretty much stop using their film gear altogether.

mwagner1 wrote:So if I am reading correctly, what you are saying is that it is currently impossible to move large amounts of data in a much faster way inside a camera body?? Is that why we are seeing lower MP (but faster) DSLRs as well as large MP (but way slower) DSLRs??

No not at all - I think you may have missed a tangent in this thread - my response was purely to Dan Baumbach's desire for a full frame 4x5 camera digital back.

The technology to do what you want exists today, it just needs to be productized and that takes some time.

No not at all - I think you may have missed a tangent in this thread - my response was purely to Dan Baumbach's desire for a full frame 4x5 camera digital back.

The technology to do what you want exists today, it just needs to be productized and that takes some time.

Okay..I was wondering if I missed something....so, what would it take to get Canon or Nikon to do it?? A gazillion letters?? LOL!!!

Cheers,

Under $3000 and Eye Control? That's the day I will swicth to digital :roll:

Maxis wrote:Under $3000 and Eye Control? That's the day I will swicth to digital :roll:

Big no on the Eye Control..LOL

Cheers,

mwagner1 wrote:Big no on the Eye Control..LOL

Cheers,

Oh yes, Eye control

Maxis wrote:
Oh yes, Eye control

Funny, I know quite a few local Canon shooters who poo poo Eye control..and that does not even count what the many pro Nikon shooters say about it!!! And that is not any sort of jealousy!!! hehehehehe

Cheers,

90% of my shooting is using the eye control feature on my EOS-3 and Elan 7E. It just work for me, but everyone have an opinion.

I have such simple requirements, to tell you the truth. 1Ds is great for lanscapes, but an updated 1D with a 6MP or greater sensor would be grand. 1.3x multiplier and 8fps is pretty ideal, IMHO.

I just wish I could get whatever is coming out before January, as I will be in Tanzania for the entire month. After that, I won't be back until June. I just hope *something* is announced and delivered before next June. My 1D was stolen recently, and I need to replace it with something. The 10D just isn't an ideal solution, but works nonetheless.