Looks like data manipulation.,,

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/earth/environment/globalwarming/11395516/The-fiddling-with-temperature-data-is-the-biggest-science-scandal-ever.html

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/11367272/Climategate-the-sequel-How-we-are-STILL-being-tricked-with-flawed-data-on-global-warming.html

https://notalotofpeopleknowthat.wordpress.com/2015/01/20/massive-tampering-with-temperatures-in-south-america/

Don Nelson wrote:http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/earth/environment/globalwarming/11395516/The-fiddling-with-temperature-data-is-the-biggest-science-scandal-ever.html

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/11367272/Climategate-the-sequel-How-we-are-STILL-being-tricked-with-flawed-data-on-global-warming.html

https://notalotofpeopleknowthat.wordpress.com/2015/01/20/massive-tampering-with-temperatures-in-south-america/

Calm down ... Christopher Booker, who wrote the Telegraph article, is a renowned climate change denier with zero scientific credibility who has been caught out again and again publishing false and unsubstantiated articles like this. Take anything he writes with a huge pinch of salt, he has some very large political axes to grind.

For example, he was outed on this as long ago as 2009:

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/georgemonbiot/2009/feb/03/climate-change-daily-telegraph-christopher-booker

In the Wikipedia biography of him it is stated in the first paragraph that "He has taken a stance which runs counter to the scientific consensus on a number of issues, including global warming, the link between passive smoking and cancer, and the dangers posed by asbestos."

... and so on.

This documentary on PBS called "The Climate of Doubt" tells a lot about the reasons for climate denial and who is behind it. I love the fact that PBS produces documentaries like this and know why some politicians want to de-fund PBS!!!!

http://video.pbs.org/video/2295533310/

This is also a good reference:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_change_denial

Joe

It's amazing how data, manufactured and real, is discarded by the alarmists when it doesn't fit their political agenda. But these same alarmists are willing to accept, defend and even extoll data that has been faked!!! Not just this case, but many instances of climate data being fudged and "estimated."
Dr Kevin Cowtan, who discovered this latest manipulation of data, is considered very neutral on the climate controversy. Go look at his data if you distrust the newspaper writer.

There is no place in a fanatic's head where reason can enter. (Napoleon Bonaparte)



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Just tell the glaciers in my backyard they aren't really melting.

In many places, they aren't melting.



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EGrav wrote:In many places, they aren't melting.

Few! Here's a link to a good show on the glaciers:

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/earth/extreme-ice.html

Joe

EGrav wrote:It's amazing how data, manufactured and real, is discarded by the alarmists when it doesn't fit their political agenda. But these same alarmists are willing to accept, defend and even extoll data that has been faked!!! Not just this case, but many instances of climate data being fudged and "estimated."
Dr Kevin Cowtan, who discovered this latest manipulation of data, is considered very neutral on the climate controversy. Go look at his data if you distrust the newspaper writer.
There is no place in a fanatic's head where reason can enter. (Napoleon Bonaparte)
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That certainly works both ways! It's more obviously biased when it benefits industry. Things said by people who are not even informed in the scientific arena are accepted as pros on the subject! If it is going to hurt the bottom line, industry can hire many "experts" to propagandize a subject to look totally different than it truly is. The claim is always made that it will cut jobs, hurt the economy, blah, blah, blah. So what!!! When we not longer have an earth to live in or health to enjoy life, what will they say? Just as they said tobacco and asbestos were not harmful, they may just change their minds, but it will be too late. 
Here is an article (or two) on Christopher Booker that should be read:

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/ ... her-booker

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/ ... misleading

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/ ... nd-climate

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/ ... her-booker

Joe

Booker did not discover the deceitful information. Look up Dr Kevin Cowtan - he discovered the discrepancies and he is a VERY respected climate expert. Several other writers are now reporting on it.
That's the problem with obsessed fanatics, they refuse to look at the possibility that maybe they are wrong. If there is so much certainty about the climate alarmists' position, why are there so many lies, fabricated data, false emails, blah, blah blah, being spread by them? Keep drinking the kool-aid. Climate changes, it always has and always will. Find another cause to crusade for. I'm outta' here.

"Fanaticism is overcompensation for doubt."
Robertson Davies



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Is it possible something else is at play? For example, why did the earth go through a previous ice age? Did the cavemen burn too many fires? Or, does the earth go through various cycles and this happens to be a warming cycle? I'm no scientist but obviously they don't have all the answers either. Maybe, just maybe, it's nothing more than that. I don't know but I'm surely not going to believe the extreme views on both sides. I never have and I never will. Until we get data that is proven and not guessing will I be on board.

"EGrav said:

Dr Kevin Cowtan, who discovered this latest manipulation of data, is considered very neutral on the climate controversy. Go look at his data if you distrust the newspaper writer.
______________________________________________________________________

Booker did not discover the deceitful information. Look up Dr Kevin Cowtan - he discovered the discrepancies and he is a VERY respected climate expert. Several other writers are now reporting on it.
That's the problem with obsessed fanatics, they refuse to look at the possibility that maybe they are wrong. If there is so much certainty about the climate alarmists' position, why are there so many lies, fabricated data, false emails, blah, blah blah, being spread by them? Keep drinking the kool-aid. Climate changes, it always has and always will. Find another cause to crusade for. I'm outta' here.

"Fanaticism is overcompensation for doubt."
Robertson Davies

Seems like you got it wrong here!!! Dr Cowtan is on the other side of the fence from Booker and far from neutral:

http://www.skepticalscience.com/kevin-c ... heory.html

http://junkscience.com/2015/02/08/dr-ke ... pagandist/

I find it amusingly ironic that you put up one of the opposing teams players as one of your star players. It helps to be better versed in the key players and the subject when you are trying to debate a subject as important as this!

As I said above, it works both ways!!!

Joe

Here are a couple of interesting links. One is about "Berkeley Earth" that shows it is funded in part by the Charles G. Koch Foundation and its findings about warming. The other is related to their findings and reactions to them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berkeley_Earth

http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2011/1 ... l-warming/

Joe

I move this topic and all related replies be removed. This is not a platform for personal political views.

bradmangas wrote:I move this topic and all related replies be removed. This is not a platform for personal political views.

While I understand your viewpoint, I will respond since I have posted more replies on this thread than anyone else. I have striven to keep this subject aplolitical. I am unaffiliated with any political party and have been so all my life. I have provided links to show how Kevin Cowtan has  been described to be a propagandist on the left, while Christopher Booker is his counterpart on the right. Both are extremists. I have provided a link to Berkeley Earth and described its' funding by the right. The results of this study have shown warming to be real, but it is denied, nonetheless. I have provided a link to the PBS show about the glaciers and how they are melting. I have provided a link to the PBS show "Climate of Doubt" to show how things are twisted and covered up. I see the monetary interests being placed above all else. I have no children and, therefore, no worries about their future. I only know what I see and can rationalize.
In my lifetime, I have seen species moving northward that were never seen before in my area. I have seen the increase in greenhouse gases in the four-corners area (there is a huge methane gas cloud there right now) and the increase in cars, trucks jet flights and the general increase in population and its' effects on the environment. The pollution in China is unbelievable, but real, albeit out of our sight. It is hard to deny the melting of the glaciers and the polar ice up north. Are these changes disassociated with man? Are they cyclical? Not in my opinion! Look at the 101 and similar highways and compare the traffic to the 50's or 60's. Look at the huge increase in population. Look at all the changes we have made to the formerly rural areas. Look at the areas that have been clearcut and others that have been paved over or built up with housing. Look up at the skies and count the contrails. We have to be affecting the climate with all this. It is not my job to convince anyone of warming, but only to encourage people to think about what we may be doing. Most people probably don't even realize that the greatest greenhouse gas, volume wise, is water vapor. It is good to be informed and not follow others opinions. If they believe or if they don't, I just hope their viewpoints are not skewed by propaganda, industry and monetary interests. It's easy to be swayed by others opinions, whether true or not. I doubt I will be around long enough to be greatly affected by all this, but many of the younger generation will certainly see the results of unbelief and inaction by this generation.

Joe

EGrav wrote:In many places, they aren't melting.

OMG

rabbit59 wrote:Is it possible something else is at play? For example, why did the earth go through a previous ice age? Did the cavemen burn too many fires? Or, does the earth go through various cycles and this happens to be a warming cycle? I'm no scientist but obviously they don't have all the answers either. Maybe, just maybe, it's nothing more than that. I don't know but I'm surely not going to believe the extreme views on both sides. I never have and I never will. Until we get data that is proven and not guessing will I be on board.

It'll be too late. Usually it's a good idea to err on the side of caution.

 

bradmangas wrote:I move this topic and all related replies be removed. This is not a platform for personal political views.

Since when a climate change is a political view ?

EGrav wrote:In many places, they aren't melting.



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Where?

EGrav wrote:Booker did not discover the deceitful information. Look up Dr Kevin Cowtan - he discovered the discrepancies and he is a VERY respected climate expert. Several other writers are now reporting on it.
That's the problem with obsessed fanatics, they refuse to look at the possibility that maybe they are wrong. If there is so much certainty about the climate alarmists' position, why are there so many lies, fabricated data, false emails, blah, blah blah, being spread by them? Keep drinking the kool-aid. Climate changes, it always has and always will. Find another cause to crusade for. I'm outta' here.

"Fanaticism is overcompensation for doubt."
Robertson Davies



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So much for intelligent conversation!!!

Andrew_5488 wrote:

bradmangas wrote:I move this topic and all related replies be removed. This is not a platform for personal political views.

Since when a climate change is a political view ?

It's not Andrew your right...But another conversation that has nothing to do with making pictures.. I'm still trying to figure out what a conversation about conservation as related to photography will actually be about.. But that's another story...