Moderator: E.J. Peiker

All times are UTC-05:00

  
« Previous topic | Next topic »  
Reply to topic  
 First unread post  | 16 posts | 
by Karl Egressy on Thu Nov 26, 2020 1:10 pm
User avatar
Karl Egressy
Forum Contributor
Posts: 39506
Joined: 11 Dec 2004
Location: Guelph, Ontario, Canada
Member #:00988
I was wondering what focus area setting would work for BIF.
The camera Sony a7RIV has the firmware update and it supposed to be
much better now for BIF if you shoot in APS-C mode.
I just would like to know the Focus Area Setting if you could help.
Thanks,
Karl.
 

by Phil Shaw on Thu Nov 26, 2020 4:11 pm
Phil Shaw
Forum Contributor
Posts: 99
Joined: 25 Aug 2003
Member #:00106
Rather than me just tell you what settings I use, it is worth watching this video which give a discussion about what might be better/best for your situation.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJx0lru_evY
Phil Shaw
Essex, UK
[color=#008000][url]http://www.naturephotopro.com[/url][/color]
 

by Andrew_5488 on Fri Nov 27, 2020 10:17 am
Andrew_5488
Forum Contributor
Posts: 390
Joined: 15 Feb 2012
Location: NY
Karl Egressy wrote:I was wondering what focus area setting would work for BIF.
The camera Sony a7RIV has the firmware update and it supposed to be
much better now for BIF if you shoot in APS-C mode.
I just would like to know the Focus Area Setting if you could help.
Thanks,
Karl.
It all depends how far you are and how big the subject is. I use full frame,zone and spot (S,M and L) all depending on particular situation.
 

by scorless on Fri Nov 27, 2020 11:21 am
scorless
Forum Contributor
Posts: 350
Joined: 27 Feb 2004
Location: Corrales, NM USA
I have had success with Zone as long as you have plenty of light. In fact Zone is my go to focus area for both the r4 and the a9. Above all I would setup one of your custom keys so that you can easily change the focus area quickly. 
Sandy Corless
 

by Karl Egressy on Mon Nov 30, 2020 8:04 pm
User avatar
Karl Egressy
Forum Contributor
Posts: 39506
Joined: 11 Dec 2004
Location: Guelph, Ontario, Canada
Member #:00988
Thanks for all the advices. I watched the video. It has some good points, learned from it. I'm very comfortable with any camera within a short time, but this impressive camera is for my wife. I simplified everything for her. One setting for BIF and one for everything else in Manual mode. Zone for BIF, single expandable point for static. Disabled most of the buttons as she likes to push them by accident. She got excellent BIF shots and excellent static shots the very first time. I love this camera, ergonomics are so much better than mine, the Sony a7R3, that is.


Last edited by Karl Egressy on Tue Dec 01, 2020 7:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
 

by E.J. Peiker on Mon Nov 30, 2020 10:22 pm
User avatar
E.J. Peiker
Senior Technical Editor
Posts: 86761
Joined: 16 Aug 2003
Location: Arizona
Member #:00002
I don't like zone or wide because it will have a tendency to grab the wing tip. I use a single spot with expansion called Tracking: Expandable Spot. This mode will try to keep in focus the spot you triggered focus on. It works well.
 

by Andrew_5488 on Mon Nov 30, 2020 10:33 pm
Andrew_5488
Forum Contributor
Posts: 390
Joined: 15 Feb 2012
Location: NY
E.J. Peiker wrote:I don't like zone or wide because it will have a tendency to grab the wing tip.  I use a single spot with expansion called Tracking: Expandable Spot.  This mode will try to keep in focus the spot you triggered focus on.  It works well.

That might be true in closer situations but when doing more of an environmental picture or photographing a fast subject,
for me it's a no-no. First of all I wouldn't be able to place a point on a subject fast enough and instead of taking pictures with zone i'd
be wasting time catching up to the subject.
When taking pictures from a distance, zone or wide is much better for me since it's much easier to place a subject in zone and f stop takes
care of depth of field.
 

by E.J. Peiker on Tue Dec 01, 2020 8:10 am
User avatar
E.J. Peiker
Senior Technical Editor
Posts: 86761
Joined: 16 Aug 2003
Location: Arizona
Member #:00002
Andrew_5488 wrote:
E.J. Peiker wrote:I don't like zone or wide because it will have a tendency to grab the wing tip.  I use a single spot with expansion called Tracking: Expandable Spot.  This mode will try to keep in focus the spot you triggered focus on.  It works well.

That might be true in closer situations but when doing more of an environmental picture or photographing a fast subject,
for me it's a no-no. First of all I wouldn't be able to place a point on a subject fast enough and instead of taking pictures with zone i'd
be wasting time catching up to the subject.
When taking pictures from a distance, zone or wide is much better for me since it's much easier to place a subject in zone and f stop takes
care of depth of field.
It takes a lot of practice :)
 

by Andrew_5488 on Tue Dec 01, 2020 10:21 am
Andrew_5488
Forum Contributor
Posts: 390
Joined: 15 Feb 2012
Location: NY
E.J. Peiker wrote:
Andrew_5488 wrote:
E.J. Peiker wrote:I don't like zone or wide because it will have a tendency to grab the wing tip.  I use a single spot with expansion called Tracking: Expandable Spot.  This mode will try to keep in focus the spot you triggered focus on.  It works well.

That might be true in closer situations but when doing more of an environmental picture or photographing a fast subject,
for me it's a no-no. First of all I wouldn't be able to place a point on a subject fast enough and instead of taking pictures with zone i'd
be wasting time catching up to the subject.
When taking pictures from a distance, zone or wide is much better for me since it's much easier to place a subject in zone and f stop takes
care of depth of field.
It takes a lot of practice :)
Again,it might be true in some situations but if you're taking pictures of falcons or other fast (or small) birds it's a fool's errand 
 unless bird is soaring or hovering. Odds of getting more pictures is with zone or wide AF (with proper f stop) in my opinion.
In situations when bird is slower or bigger I'd agree with you.
 

by Lensmaster on Wed Dec 02, 2020 3:00 pm
Lensmaster
Forum Contributor
Posts: 145
Joined: 30 Jan 2012
Although I use a -a9mkII now I use wide tracking on bbf and another button with tracking flexible spot large so I can very quickly change, here in the UK birds really don't like humans and veer off as soon as they see you unless your lucky.

Rob.
 

by Scott Fairbairn on Thu Dec 03, 2020 12:15 pm
User avatar
Scott Fairbairn
Forum Contributor
Posts: 5131
Joined: 13 Jan 2005
Member #:00437
Good luck Karl, I know the area well where you shoot the Long-tails, and I haven't found a setting for the mark 4 that gives a good result, and I've tried them all. When I use the A9, it hardly matters what focus setting I use; it nails almost all shots. Mark 4, on the other hand, is a long way behind. I've given up on using the mark 4 for BIF. On Fred Miranda forums, there's a lot of discussion about unreliable AF on the mark 4 with the 200-600. I'm not sure if I agree with it or not, but I find that it is a pretty poor second compared to the A9.
 

by Karl Egressy on Fri Dec 04, 2020 6:53 pm
User avatar
Karl Egressy
Forum Contributor
Posts: 39506
Joined: 11 Dec 2004
Location: Guelph, Ontario, Canada
Member #:00988
Scott Fairbairn wrote:Good luck Karl, I know the area well where you shoot the Long-tails, and I haven't found a setting for the mark 4 that gives a good result, and I've tried them all. When I use the A9, it hardly matters what focus setting I use; it nails almost all shots. Mark 4, on the other hand, is a long way behind. I've given up on using the mark 4 for BIF. On Fred Miranda forums, there's a lot of discussion about unreliable AF on the mark 4 with the 200-600. I'm not sure if I agree with it or not, but I find that it is a pretty poor second compared to the A9.


Thanks Scott.
I talked to Ray Barlow about a week ago and he said that ever since they updated the firmware of the a7RIV camera to 1.20 in August this year, it has become almost as good as the A9.
He, just like you, has both cameras.
Also, I watched Mark Smith's video and he praises the a7RIV camera and he is almost strictly a BIF photographer.
He used to shoot with Nikon equipment before.
Did you check your firmware?
Is your info regarding BIF after the update?
Just curious. I actually am using a a7RIII and wish I would have waited a few month and bought the IV as Marienna did.
 

by Scott Fairbairn on Sat Dec 05, 2020 11:36 am
User avatar
Scott Fairbairn
Forum Contributor
Posts: 5131
Joined: 13 Jan 2005
Member #:00437
Karl Egressy wrote:
Scott Fairbairn wrote:Good luck Karl, I know the area well where you shoot the Long-tails, and I haven't found a setting for the mark 4 that gives a good result, and I've tried them all. When I use the A9, it hardly matters what focus setting I use; it nails almost all shots. Mark 4, on the other hand, is a long way behind. I've given up on using the mark 4 for BIF. On Fred Miranda forums, there's a lot of discussion about unreliable AF on the mark 4 with the 200-600. I'm not sure if I agree with it or not, but I find that it is a pretty poor second compared to the A9.


Thanks Scott.
I talked to Ray Barlow about a week ago and he said that ever since they updated the firmware of the a7RIV camera to 1.20 in August this year, it has become almost as good as the A9.
He, just like you, has both cameras.
Also, I watched Mark Smith's video and he praises the a7RIV camera and he is almost strictly a BIF photographer.
He used to shoot with Nikon equipment before.
Did you check your firmware?
Is your info regarding BIF after the update?
Just curious. I actually am using a a7RIII and wish I would have waited a few month and bought the IV as Marienna did.
Hi Karl, I haven't tried BIF with the new firmware. I had a lot of trouble updating the firmware due to something on my computer, and I didn't update it until recently(I've no idea why Sony makes updating their firmware such a chore compared to others). Are they noticing a big improvement when used on the 200-600, or when used on other lenses like the big primes or 100-400?
I'll have to take a trip to the lift bridge soon to test it out. I'll post here once I try it out. I might get there tomorrow.
 

by Karl Egressy on Sun Dec 06, 2020 8:36 am
User avatar
Karl Egressy
Forum Contributor
Posts: 39506
Joined: 11 Dec 2004
Location: Guelph, Ontario, Canada
Member #:00988
Scott Fairbairn wrote:
Karl Egressy wrote:
Scott Fairbairn wrote:Good luck Karl, I know the area well where you shoot the Long-tails, and I haven't found a setting for the mark 4 that gives a good result, and I've tried them all. When I use the A9, it hardly matters what focus setting I use; it nails almost all shots. Mark 4, on the other hand, is a long way behind. I've given up on using the mark 4 for BIF. On Fred Miranda forums, there's a lot of discussion about unreliable AF on the mark 4 with the 200-600. I'm not sure if I agree with it or not, but I find that it is a pretty poor second compared to the A9.


Thanks Scott.
I talked to Ray Barlow about a week ago and he said that ever since they updated the firmware of the a7RIV camera to 1.20 in August this year, it has become almost as good as the A9.
He, just like you, has both cameras.
Also, I watched Mark Smith's video and he praises the a7RIV camera and he is almost strictly a BIF photographer.
He used to shoot with Nikon equipment before.
Did you check your firmware?
Is your info regarding BIF after the update?
Just curious. I actually am using a a7RIII and wish I would have waited a few month and bought the IV as Marienna did.
Hi Karl, I haven't tried BIF with the new firmware. I had a lot of trouble updating the firmware due to something on my computer, and I didn't update it until recently(I've no idea why Sony makes updating their firmware such a chore compared to others). Are they noticing a big improvement when used on the 200-600, or when used on other lenses like the big primes or 100-400?
I'll have to take a trip to the lift bridge soon to test it out. I'll post here once I try it out. I might get there tomorrow.
Hi Scott, Ray Barlow originally had the 100-400 lens and the two aforementioned cameras. Then he sold the 100-400 and bought the 200-600 lens, but I never got a word in edgewise as to why he sold the lens and which lens he tried the updated a7RIV for BIF. An other shooting friend just sold every Nikon equipment and switched to Sony. He just got the 600 Sony lens he ordered and used it with the 2.0x extender yesterday, but his camera is a Sony a9II so he won't know. Try it out and let me know your finding. Marienna actually uses her new a7RIV  with the only lens she has, the 70-350mm lens, that is.
 

by Scott Fairbairn on Sun Dec 06, 2020 7:25 pm
User avatar
Scott Fairbairn
Forum Contributor
Posts: 5131
Joined: 13 Jan 2005
Member #:00437
Karl Egressy wrote:
Scott Fairbairn wrote:
Karl Egressy wrote:
Scott Fairbairn wrote:Good luck Karl, I know the area well where you shoot the Long-tails, and I haven't found a setting for the mark 4 that gives a good result, and I've tried them all. When I use the A9, it hardly matters what focus setting I use; it nails almost all shots. Mark 4, on the other hand, is a long way behind. I've given up on using the mark 4 for BIF. On Fred Miranda forums, there's a lot of discussion about unreliable AF on the mark 4 with the 200-600. I'm not sure if I agree with it or not, but I find that it is a pretty poor second compared to the A9.


Thanks Scott.
I talked to Ray Barlow about a week ago and he said that ever since they updated the firmware of the a7RIV camera to 1.20 in August this year, it has become almost as good as the A9.
He, just like you, has both cameras.
Also, I watched Mark Smith's video and he praises the a7RIV camera and he is almost strictly a BIF photographer.
He used to shoot with Nikon equipment before.
Did you check your firmware?
Is your info regarding BIF after the update?
Just curious. I actually am using a a7RIII and wish I would have waited a few month and bought the IV as Marienna did.
Hi Karl, I haven't tried BIF with the new firmware. I had a lot of trouble updating the firmware due to something on my computer, and I didn't update it until recently(I've no idea why Sony makes updating their firmware such a chore compared to others). Are they noticing a big improvement when used on the 200-600, or when used on other lenses like the big primes or 100-400?
I'll have to take a trip to the lift bridge soon to test it out. I'll post here once I try it out. I might get there tomorrow.
Hi Scott, Ray Barlow originally had the 100-400 lens and the two aforementioned cameras. Then he sold the 100-400 and bought the 200-600 lens, but I never got a word in edgewise as to why he sold the lens and which lens he tried the updated a7RIV for BIF. An other shooting friend just sold every Nikon equipment and switched to Sony. He just got the 600 Sony lens he ordered and used it with the 2.0x extender yesterday, but his camera is a Sony a9II so he won't know. Try it out and let me know your finding. Marienna actually uses her new a7RIV  with the only lens she has, the 70-350mm lens, that is.
Hi Karl, I went to the lift bridge today(btw, there was a nice Male Surf Scoter in close) and tried the A7R4 with the 200-600. It does seem a lot better than before. I alternated with my A9, and the A9 is quite a bit better than the A7R4 IMO. However, the R4 worked well enough that I'd be comfortable using it for BIF if I needed the reach; otherwise, I'd use the A9. 
The 100-400 is a superb close-focusing lens and works well with converters too. I didn't bring it with me so I don't know how it performs with the R4 for BIF.
One thing I'd forgotten about is the rolling shutter on the R4. I used electronic shutter the entire time, and my background is filled with some very strange looking ducks! 
 

by Karl Egressy on Mon Dec 07, 2020 6:59 am
User avatar
Karl Egressy
Forum Contributor
Posts: 39506
Joined: 11 Dec 2004
Location: Guelph, Ontario, Canada
Member #:00988
Scott Fairbairn wrote:
Karl Egressy wrote:
Scott Fairbairn wrote:
Karl Egressy wrote:
Scott Fairbairn wrote:Good luck Karl, I know the area well where you shoot the Long-tails, and I haven't found a setting for the mark 4 that gives a good result, and I've tried them all. When I use the A9, it hardly matters what focus setting I use; it nails almost all shots. Mark 4, on the other hand, is a long way behind. I've given up on using the mark 4 for BIF. On Fred Miranda forums, there's a lot of discussion about unreliable AF on the mark 4 with the 200-600. I'm not sure if I agree with it or not, but I find that it is a pretty poor second compared to the A9.


Thanks Scott.
I talked to Ray Barlow about a week ago and he said that ever since they updated the firmware of the a7RIV camera to 1.20 in August this year, it has become almost as good as the A9.
He, just like you, has both cameras.
Also, I watched Mark Smith's video and he praises the a7RIV camera and he is almost strictly a BIF photographer.
He used to shoot with Nikon equipment before.
Did you check your firmware?
Is your info regarding BIF after the update?
Just curious. I actually am using a a7RIII and wish I would have waited a few month and bought the IV as Marienna did.
Hi Karl, I haven't tried BIF with the new firmware. I had a lot of trouble updating the firmware due to something on my computer, and I didn't update it until recently(I've no idea why Sony makes updating their firmware such a chore compared to others). Are they noticing a big improvement when used on the 200-600, or when used on other lenses like the big primes or 100-400?
I'll have to take a trip to the lift bridge soon to test it out. I'll post here once I try it out. I might get there tomorrow.
Hi Scott, Ray Barlow originally had the 100-400 lens and the two aforementioned cameras. Then he sold the 100-400 and bought the 200-600 lens, but I never got a word in edgewise as to why he sold the lens and which lens he tried the updated a7RIV for BIF. An other shooting friend just sold every Nikon equipment and switched to Sony. He just got the 600 Sony lens he ordered and used it with the 2.0x extender yesterday, but his camera is a Sony a9II so he won't know. Try it out and let me know your finding. Marienna actually uses her new a7RIV  with the only lens she has, the 70-350mm lens, that is.
Hi Karl, I went to the lift bridge today(btw, there was a nice Male Surf Scoter in close) and tried the A7R4 with the 200-600. It does seem a lot better than before. I alternated with my A9, and the A9 is quite a bit better than the A7R4 IMO. However, the R4 worked well enough that I'd be comfortable using it for BIF if I needed the reach; otherwise, I'd use the A9. 
The 100-400 is a superb close-focusing lens and works well with converters too. I didn't bring it with me so I don't know how it performs with the R4 for BIF.
One thing I'd forgotten about is the rolling shutter on the R4. I used electronic shutter the entire time, and my background is filled with some very strange looking ducks! 

Thanks, Scott. I knew about the Surf Scoter but my wife was very tired after shooting from 9AM to 2PM at Sedgewick and La Salle, so we did not go. Maybe today or tomorrow. It's a good news that the R4 worked better, thanks. 
 

Display posts from previous:  Sort by:  
16 posts | 
  

Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group