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by Martin 095 on Tue Jul 02, 2019 6:58 am
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I was given a Nikon D3200 with its two kit lenses (18-55/55-200 variable aperture Nikkors) a few years ago as a gift.  While clearly not up to the same standards as the rest of my gear (D800 with a variety of f/2.8 or f/4 lenses), this was a relatively small, lightweight but flexible kit with decent IQ.  It made a perfect secondary kit that I liked to keep in my office so that when time availed itself, I could shoot NYC without overburdening myself.  Unfortunately, this was stolen from me about 8-9 months ago and I am in the process of replacing it.
 
I upgraded the body substantially – I now own a D7200 – but I am struggling with lenses.  I like the idea of just two lenses that cover at least 18-200 mm.  The kit lenses are decent but will buy them only if better lenses will break the bank for me.  I have read a lot of very good reviews about Sigma’s Contemporary 17-70/2.8 with OS, so I have decided this will be one lens I purchase.
 
The real issue is the second lens.  Based on Thom Hogan’s evaluation, my first thought was the Nikkor 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6E AF-P VR but now I am also considering Tamron’s SP 70-300mm F/4-5.6 Di VC USD (can we add a few more letters???) – I don't think Sigma makes a comparable quality lens with IS in this range.  I probably cannot afford either lens brand new, so I am considering used but regardless, I am hoping I can get some advice from users to help me make my decision.  I would be using this lens almost exclusively on my 7200, but there might be an occasion when I would mount it on my D800 – I top out at 200 mm with that system.  I would appreciate hearing from anyone that has used either or both lenses so I can make the best decision for my needs. I shoot landscape/cityscape and some macro fwiw.
 
I would like the best IQ possible in the smallest package possible (at this price point obviously) and I definitely want IS on the lens as well.  I suppose the DX version of the Nikkor is also a possibility, but I lose some flexibility (VR cannot be turned off on the D7200) and some speed (albeit it just a third of a stop).
 
TIA for your help.
Best wishes,

Martin
"[i]If there is a sin against life, it consists, perhaps not so much in despairing of life, as hoping for another life and eluding the implacable grandeur of this life[/i]." - Albert Camus
 

by E.J. Peiker on Tue Jul 02, 2019 7:23 am
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The Nikon AF-P is clearly the superior lens between the two and the lens is still pretty decent on a D800 - if it were me in your situation, that's the one I would go for.
 

by Martin 095 on Tue Jul 02, 2019 2:54 pm
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Thanks EJ.  The older AFS lens is more readily available, cheaper, and has no compatibility issues – does anyone know if the IQ of the newer AFP lens is that much better to warrant the added cost?
Best wishes,

Martin
"[i]If there is a sin against life, it consists, perhaps not so much in despairing of life, as hoping for another life and eluding the implacable grandeur of this life[/i]." - Albert Camus
 

by DChan on Tue Jul 02, 2019 4:04 pm
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Martin 095 wrote:Thanks EJ.  The older AFS lens is more readily available, cheaper, and has no compatibility issues – does anyone know if the IQ of the newer AFP lens is that much better to warrant the added cost?
Don't believe EJ ?? That's weird  :lol:

How about Thom?

Nikon 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6 AF-P VR


Nikon 70-300mm f/4.5-6.3 AF-P VR DX


Imagingresources:

Nikon 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6G IF-ED VR AF-S Nikkor
 

by Martin 095 on Tue Jul 02, 2019 5:05 pm
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DChan,

I think you missed my point – I absolutely believe EJ, but he was suggesting that I buy the more recent AFP lens (over the Tamron, which was my original question). This is more expensive and is hard to find used. However, the older AFS lens is readily available used and is less expensive. So my question was whether or not the improved IQ for the newer lens is worth the difference in price (AFP vs AFS). I realize this is a confusing situation since Nikon has made 5 versions of this zoom.
Best wishes,

Martin
"[i]If there is a sin against life, it consists, perhaps not so much in despairing of life, as hoping for another life and eluding the implacable grandeur of this life[/i]." - Albert Camus
 

by DChan on Tue Jul 02, 2019 6:08 pm
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Martin 095 wrote:DChan,

I think you missed my point – I absolutely believe EJ, but he was suggesting that I buy the more recent AFP lens (over the Tamron, which was my original question).  This is more expensive and is hard to find used.  However, the older AFS lens is readily available used and is less expensive.  So my question was whether or not the improved IQ for the newer lens is worth the difference in price (AFP vs AFS).  I realize this is a confusing situation since Nikon has made 5 versions of this zoom.
You've been told the newer lens is better. Linked reviews suggest the same thing. If you do not intend to buy the better lens, then get the old one. It's not as confusing as you think as all reviews clearly explained it. I guess the problem is you prefer to get a used one (may be because it's just a D7200? :P ). Perhaps you should rent one, if available, and use it to see for yourself because, at the end of the day, how much the difference is worth could be subjective.

How about this: what do you think the price of that latest version of the 70-300 f4 should be?
 

by SantaFeJoe on Tue Jul 02, 2019 7:58 pm
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Martin 095 wrote: 
.....This is more expensive and is hard to find used.  However, the older AFS lens is readily available used and is less expensive.  So my question was whether or not the improved IQ for the newer lens is worth the difference in price (AFP vs AFS).
If you buy a used AFS, try to make sure it can be returned or, at least, tried out before purchase. I have seen the VR fail in these lenses and it’s certainly not worth repairing if it isn’t working. My friend had one that he used a lot to shoot wild horses and it was impressive, but the VR did fail on his. Unless it is really cheap, and I have seen them for $250, new is probably the way to go.

Joe
Learn the rules like a pro, so you can break them like an artist.  -Pablo Picasso
 

by DChan on Tue Jul 02, 2019 10:54 pm
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For your reference, there's a refurbished version of the 70-300 f4.5-5.6 E ED-VR available at B&H for $549:

Nikon AF-P NIKKOR 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6E ED VR Lens (Refurbished)


New one here ($596.95):

Nikon AF-P NIKKOR 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6E ED VR Lens


$599.95 per Nikon USA.


Per Thom this lens is good enough even for D850.
 

by E.J. Peiker on Tue Jul 02, 2019 11:00 pm
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The reliability of the mechanical aperture linkage on the older G lenses is just so much lower than it is on the fully electronic aperture control E lenses that I would not today buy a G lens.  There aren't AF-P lens compatibility issues with a D7200 and D800 and they can be adapted with much better AF performance should you ever decide to go mirrorless.  Plus the optical quality is better.  The AF-S 70-300E was already limiting the D3x full frame 24mp camera which had much larger pixels than a D7200 or D800 so basically you would be relegating your D800 to the equivalent of something around 20-24megapixels worth of resolving power in 36 megapixel files and about 11 megapixels worth of resolving power contained in a 24mp file on the D7200.
 

by Martin 095 on Wed Jul 03, 2019 5:41 am
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Thanks for all the help – this is the info I was looking for. All things being equal I would definitely opt for a new lens every time, but I can't afford one right now, so I will wait rather than buy an inferior lens. I appreciate the advice.
Best wishes,

Martin
"[i]If there is a sin against life, it consists, perhaps not so much in despairing of life, as hoping for another life and eluding the implacable grandeur of this life[/i]." - Albert Camus
 

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