New Epson 3880 (replaced Designjet 130)

Out with the old, in with the new!   But of course I had to make some comparisons...

I've printed the same image on both printers.  The Epson used one of the Premium Luster sheets that came with the printer.   The HP used my standard setup with custom profiles on HP Premium Photo Plus Satin.  The results were very similar but the Designjet had more "pop" to it.   The blacks definitely seem darker.

Comparing the two profiles in Gamutvision the Epson profile has a Dmax of 2.13  and the HP has a Dmax of 2.42  (both with BPC off).    Given the glowing comments about Epson Ultra Super Duper Premium Luster (or whatever they call it these days) I'm a little shocked at the difference.  Is this really as good as it gets on the 3880?  Or do I need a custom profile?

Right now it's feeling like a step backwards!

You probably need a custom profile to bring out the best of the Epson.

But more than that, you're to some extent comparing apples & oranges. The Epson uses a pigment based inkset with a different type of head design (cold piezoelectric), while the HP DesignJet is a thermal head design using dye-based inks. Dye inksets typically have a somewhat more colorful and contrasty appearance (including deeper blacks on glossy media) compared to pigment, due to the characteristics of the particles laid on paper. This is why people use dye-based inks. But of course the longevity of dye is substantially less than with pigment. But piezo heads have other advantages in ink design which is why Epson uses them.

The combination of head design and inkset design creates differences that will be visible on certain media and/or with certain images. No two printing technologies work precisely the same as each other across the range of all possible image reproduction. Even though the HP blacks appear deeper, for example, the Epson will produce a greater range of subtlety and neutrality of grey tones due to its separate photo & matte blacks, and its shades of light and light-light grey. So I suspect you will find it's actually going to be a better performer for B&W printing, for example, than the HP, when considered across a range of images.

And when your printing workflow is tuned up for the Epson's print characteristics. Optimal results on a given printing system usually involve soft proofing & hard proofing the image and making print-specific adjustments to the image to make it work best given the reproduction qualities of the printer. This is even after good calibration & profiling of the printer.

Royce made all the technical points I would have made. Every printer is different, you can't just print an image optimized for ne type of printer and then print it on a different one and expect equivalent results. As you get to know the 3880 and what papers you like best with it, i have no doubt that you will get prints that you are very happy with and they will last a lot longer than the prints you have made on the HP which are not archival in nature.

Has anyone on the forum gone to the trouble of getting custom profiles made for Epson papers?  The 3880 has been out for a while so hopefully there are some who can share their experience.

In any case I agree, fine-tuning for the 3880 is still to be done.  I guess this is the start of that process!  lol

Also FWIW, the HP prints are in fact archival (but sadly the printer wasn't!).  Wilhelm rates the prints at 82 years (for comparison the 4800 on Luster is rated 71 years).

bjs wrote:Has anyone on the forum gone to the trouble of getting custom profiles made for Epson papers?  The 3880 has been out for a while so hopefully there are some who can share their experience

No-one? 

The Epson profiles do seem pretty decent...but I would have thought *someone* might have tried to see if they can be bettered.

bjs wrote:

bjs wrote:Has anyone on the forum gone to the trouble of getting custom profiles made for Epson papers?  The 3880 has been out for a while so hopefully there are some who can share their experience

No-one? 

The Epson profiles do seem pretty decent...but I would have thought *someone* might have tried to see if they can be bettered.

The key part of your question (for me--and the reason I didn't reply earlier) was "for Epson papers."  I've had a couple of custom profiles made for the 3880, but not for Epson papers.

I expect the answer for most is the same as what Kerry said. I doubt most people who go to the effort of getting custom profiles made are using Epson papers...

Thanks....makes sense.   

Although in talking with a couple custom profile providers they said the 3880 was one of their most common printers and the Epson Premium Lustre was one of the most common requests.  So i was curious as to the improvements people saw.