Motif: Do I have any Pelican pix???


Posted by Arthur Morris on Sun Oct 19, 2003 9:50 am

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Brown Pelican is probably second in terms of number of images in my files behind Great Blue Heron... Ooops, forgot about Snow Geese.
IAC, this California race bird was photographed in LaJolla, CA with the 600mm f/4 L IS lens, and an EOS 1V body witht the 2X TC. Provia F 100 pushed one stop. Evalautive metering at zero: somehwere around 1/250 at f/11. All comments welcome.
Best and great picture-making to all, Artie
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by Bob Ettinger on Sun Oct 19, 2003 10:13 am
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Artie,

Great detail and I really like the composition.
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by Heather Forcier on Sun Oct 19, 2003 10:57 am
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I agree with Bob, the detail and the composition are very appealing in this image.
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by Anthony Medici on Sun Oct 19, 2003 11:00 am
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The details present here are wonderful. I'm not positive I like the little bit of blue on the bottom right hand corner and I would be tempted to make this a 5:4 ratio image from the left as I feel it would make the image even stronger. :)
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by Greg Downing on Sun Oct 19, 2003 11:28 am
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Artie, I thought the sandhill crane would be way up there in terms of number of images for you. I know that if they were in my back yard they sure would be close to the top. ;)

Anyway, this has always been one of my favorites and it looks amazing projected. I am afraid the scan doesn't do it justice here and there is a bit of a color cast to it, on the green side. I like the composition as is and would not want to give up the white on the neck for cropping the right side.

Now go dig out the head throw and the balancing on one foot shot. :D
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by Karen S on Sun Oct 19, 2003 1:23 pm
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Beautiful shot Arthur!!!!
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by Alan Murphy on Sun Oct 19, 2003 2:37 pm
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Atrie, love the whole image. Not as sharp as the slide I'm sure. Love the alert eye.
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by RichardMittleman/Gon2Foto on Sun Oct 19, 2003 3:52 pm
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I must admit that I feel a little uncomfortable critiquing an Art Morris image, but the composition feels awkward to me and there does seem to be a color cast.
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by E.J. Peiker on Sun Oct 19, 2003 4:51 pm
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I've always liked this shot a lot. It does have a blue cast as presented here.
 

by Sheri Whala on Sun Oct 19, 2003 8:56 pm
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I really like the composition on this! Way cool! 8)
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by Bill Whala on Sun Oct 19, 2003 9:05 pm
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What a wonderful composition. Yeah, a little soft as presented but I'm sure the slide is killer.

Awesome!!
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by Wil Hershberger on Mon Oct 20, 2003 5:14 am
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Gorgeous shot. I love the pose and the comp.
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by Bruce DiVaccaro on Mon Oct 20, 2003 5:23 am
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Artie,

Wonderful composition and detail.
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by Arthur Morris on Mon Oct 20, 2003 5:41 am
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Thanks for all the comments and suggestions. I do love this image (which is in the Corbis collection but has not sold...), and I would not change a thing compositionally. Since going digital, I am having more problems than I remember with color casts and sharpness when working with scanned slides. I am willing and eager to learn. (I did forget to sharpen this one more than I would a digital image...) BTW, with digital images it is extremely rare that I find any need to adjust the color balance (though I almost always boost the saturation). OK, back to the learning:
#1- I would assume that it is best to go back to the master when doing any color correction (rather than working on the j-peg). Please confirm that this is correct.
#2: After completing the work, my understanding is that the color profile should be converted to sRGB. Again, please confirm this.
#3: I experimented with the eyedropper method for correcting the color balance (though I am not sure that I had all the steps down just right...)
I know that you work with the right hand eye-dropper symbol when you are working with the whites. Should you do the same thing with middle tones with the middle eye dropper?
#4: In this image, the whites were not bad; the numbers showed blue and green about equal, the red about 20 points less... Most of the feathers exhibited about 20 points more blue and with a little less red than green. How do you correct different color balance problems in an image (here in the highlights and in the middle tones)?
#5:The background averaged R:50, G:75, B: 100. Is this a color cast or do these numbers show that the background is indeed blue????
Thanks for trying to help!
And best, your student, Artie
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by Greg Downing on Mon Oct 20, 2003 7:09 am
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Thanks for all the comments and suggestions. I do love this image (which is in the Corbis collection but has not sold...), and I would not change a thing compositionally. Since going digital, I am having more problems than I remember with color casts and sharpness when working with scanned slides. I am willing and eager to learn. (I did forget to sharpen this one more than I would a digital image...) BTW, with digital images it is extremely rare that I find any need to adjust the color balance (though I almost always boost the saturation). OK, back to the learning:

Scanned images are more often problematic when it comes to color casts when compared to digital captures. You are not alone. :)

#1- I would assume that it is best to go back to the master when doing any color correction (rather than working on the j-peg). Please confirm that this is correct.

That is correct. It can be done with the JPEG if you want, it just wouldn't correct the master file (obviously).

#2: After completing the work, my understanding is that the color profile should be converted to sRGB. Again, please confirm this.

For web images that is correct, as a last step prior to saving. This allows the image to be viewed as intended since the web uses sRGB as its color space.

#3: I experimented with the eyedropper method for correcting the color balance (though I am not sure that I had all the steps down just right...)
I know that you work with the right hand eye-dropper symbol when you are working with the whites. Should you do the same thing with middle tones with the middle eye dropper?

It is usually best to check at least the highlights and the shadows in the image, but it is not required. Use the midtones when there is nothing in the image that is to be true white or true black, or to check an area that you know should be neutral but not white or black. Remember there are some images that have no true neutral tones in them, in which case everything must be done by eye. Many birds do have black in their eyes though...This image has white and black so I would recommend setting both the white point and the black point.

#4: In this image, the whites were not bad; the numbers showed blue and green about equal, the red about 20 points less... Most of the feathers exhibited about 20 points more blue and with a little less red than green. How do you correct different color balance problems in an image (here in the highlights and in the middle tones)?

20 points less of red mean you have a green/blue cast to it, just as it looks. To answer your question you need to sample a number of areas in the whites and set your white point based on each area until you are happy with how the image looks. To best accomplish this your monitor needs to be calibrated so that it doesn't have any bias toward any color.

#5:The background averaged R:50, G:75, B: 100. Is this a color cast or do these numbers show that the background is indeed blue????

Pay no attention to the background when checking for a color cast (unless you know the background should be white, black or gray), it is supposed to be blue here (or blue-green, or whatever it is). You need to work with tones in the image that you know are supposed to be neutral; white black or gray.

Thanks for trying to help!
And best, your student, Artie

You're welcome. :)

Below is the adjusted image. I set the black point first and then the white point, which is my usual way of doing things. I did sharpen it a touch (2x at 100/.02/0) but the image already shows some artifacts, so it only made them worse. I did not go through the trouble to selectively sharpening it. Also the background has the stair-stepping effect to it. Best to make all your levels and saturation adjustments in 16 bit mode in order to prevent this, then switch to 8-bit before sharpening etc. Also, the original is only 40K in size, which could have something to do with the uneven background as well as the artifacts.

Realize I did nothing but set the white and black points in the image below (besides mild sharpening) but look how all the colors fall into place; the reds and yellows are more vibrant etc. Just goes to show how color casts can rob your image of all it's pop!

If you do not remember the steps for setting the desired numbers please let me know.

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Last edited by Greg Downing on Mon Oct 20, 2003 7:40 am, edited 2 times in total.
 

by Bill Keown on Mon Oct 20, 2003 7:39 am
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Artie
This has always been one of my favorite images of yours.

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by Arthur Morris on Mon Oct 20, 2003 8:00 am
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Thank you Gregory! Your explanations were clear and consice and now, it all makes sense to me! Thanks for the re-post!
And best and love, Artie
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by RichardMittleman/Gon2Foto on Mon Oct 20, 2003 10:06 am
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Art,
I just got your latest email newsletter and it looks as if you have this same image there except it is flipped.
For some reason it looks better that way than this way.
Oops, just looked more carefully and it's a different bird, but a very similar pose and compositon except in its left to right orientation.
I still like the composition in the first one in your email better.
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by Mike Wilson on Mon Oct 20, 2003 1:32 pm
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A feast for the eyes. Love the composition and the great detail.
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by Juan E. Bahamon on Mon Oct 20, 2003 3:32 pm
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Artie:

I saw this image projected I was so amazed for its beauty. The first post really made a diservice to the bird, but I admire your humility in recognizing the steep learning curve of digital stuff. Greg magic worked here wonders. If it was possible to clone and merge Artie and Greg in one body, many nature photographers either retire or like me will commit suicide.
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