Workshop Cancellation

Hey, I'm hoping to get some advice from the folks that offer workshops.  Last November I booked a trip from an individual doing a workshop in July.  The specific location we are visiting is a facility "ranch" (Non-US) that offers accommodations to individuals as well.  My preference is to do a workshop for the travel organizational assistance and the camaraderie.  I paid the deposit, bought my plane tickets and started planning.  

On March 1st, I got an email asking if I could change the dates.  I've done a bunch of workshops and this has never happened.  Once I told him that I had flights and made plans, he said he would have to cancel.  Given he cancelled, I immediately contacted the "ranch" and secure a spot individually.  

Should I expect to get my money back, assuming this isn't some outright fraud?  Or am I just out of luck?  The tour operator cancelled the trip, not me.  He is actually blaming me saying I cancelled and booked it directly.  I have been as vague as possible, but the operator is on this site.  I considered that as proof that it was a legitimate deal in the first place.  

I would expect a refund if I paid someone a deposit and they cancelled. If you have an email from the vendor that says they are cancelling that should be enough. The fact that you booked the ranch directly just means you are avoiding losing out from cancelling/re-scheduling costs on your flights. You should not be under any obligation to shift dates because the vendor has an issue.

Many "workshops" have non refundable deposits. I always buy trip insurance to cover this possibility. The insurance also covers me in case I get sick or have a family emergency and covers out of country medical care if I need it.

Don't know what the insurance is like elsewhere, I did the research reading fine print a while back and here in Australia they only cover this if you can't go because of a medical or other specified cause. Failure of the tour company to provide the services is generally specifically excluded. Read the fine print!

I still don't think this is justified and would expect even a "non- refundable" deposit to be refunded if the vendor does not provide the services offered. Non refundable deposit is generally to discourage people from dropping out at inconvenient times and protect the operator from losses if people drop out and can't be "replaced" . The fact the operator has till July to sort things out makes it even less justifiable.

If you paid by card you could try contesting the charge for non delivery of services paid for.

ChrisRoss wrote:Don't know what the insurance is like elsewhere, I did the research reading fine print a while back and here in Australia they only cover this if you can't go because of a medical or other specified cause.  Failure of the tour company to provide the services is generally specifically excluded.  Read the fine print!  

I still don't think this is justified and would expect even a "non- refundable" deposit to be refunded if the vendor does not provide the services offered.  Non refundable deposit is generally to discourage people from dropping out at inconvenient times and protect the operator from losses if people drop out and can't be "replaced" .  The fact the operator has till July to sort things out makes it even less justifiable.

If you paid by card you could try contesting the charge for non delivery of services paid for.

I think Chris is right on point. The tour operator is changing the date not you so he is obligated to either offer the tour at a time YOU can make it or REFUND your deposit. Like Chris said "If you paid by card you could try contesting the charge for non delivery of services paid for."

I just got confirmation that the operator refunded part of my money.  The original deposit, minus the substantial bank fees.  Please note the operator has no affiliation with with Naturescapes, but is a member on the site.  I'll share some more details now I have my money.  (Or most of it)  On the insurance, my travel agent told me that she didn't think it would cover the trip being cancelled by the operator.  I've very disappointed in the vendor.  

Here's a redacted excerpt of the initial conversation about the cancellation:

"I've had three people pull out of the trip just leaving you and one man now. But the gentleman cannot make the dates now also and has asked can I move the trip forward to those dates - Monday 2-Saturday 7th

You can't do those so at the present time I only have one client - you at the original dates and that's not enough for me to run the trip- costings  etc.

So I'm hoping he can either move or I get other clients otherwise I will have to cancel the trip.

I can put you in touch with xxxxx and xxxxx who run the lodge and you can still go perhaps ? And it's the same but without me or I can give you a refund ?"

At this point I asked for my money back.  

And proceeded to this:
"I followed the following directions from you and the bank charged me £25 to send it and £45 to bounce it back while asking me more questions about the transaction.  

The woman said it didn't add up that's all and the questions are part of Barclays business.

To send this again is going to cost me another £25 and I am not paying for these costs when I've followed your instructions.

You've cost me money for pulling out of the trip and going direct also.

Nobody in 9 years of doing trips like this for a living has done that to me and pulled out.

I have the terms and conditions in place on my website to protect myself as a small business.

I refunded you the money in good faith and it's costs me money now because the bank refused to send the money and it was put into a holding account before being put back into my account minus their fees.

Please see the following photos one of your details you sent to me and one of the copy from the bank refund showing I sent it in good faith on the 2nd March 2018.

I need the correct bank details to be able to send this now and I will be deducting all the bank costs I've incurred.

As you will see deposits are none refundable because I have to pay for "services" in this case the services in xxxxx.

Good that it was refunded, bank fees I wouldn't expect to get back, they are quite exorbitant though! Seems like the thing to do would would have been to direct your funds to the lodge with your agreement if he can't provide the service. With 3 months till the trip it could even have been along the lines, the funds will go to the lodge, if I pick enough customers I'll be there, if not at least you can go.

It is appalling that this guy even considered not refunding your money given the fact that he is the one who changed the dates/cancelled the trip! Every tour I have booked clearly states that if the tour company cancels the trip, they provide a full refund.

If tour operators did not have a policy of refunding fees if they are the ones who cancel, then what is to stop unethical operators from booking people on trips they have no intention of actually providing, then cancelling those trips and keeping the deposits without ever having done anything at all (including not incurring any expenses for reserving locations etc)? 

That bank fee thing is a bit confusing to me. I can see him charging you the bank's single fee to provide a refund by wire or whatever, but I am not clear on those extra fees for the refund not going through. if you provided him incorrect transit information for your account and that is why he had to incur that extra fee, then I can see why he would charge you for that. Maybe I am missing something.

Travel insurance in my experience does not cover losses if the tour operator cancels the trip outright as insurance figures the operator would refund the money.

Anyway, it is good you got most of you money back. I am sure going forward we will all read the terms and conditions more carefully to make sure the operator will refund fees in the event the operator chooses to cancel a trip. Ideally these terms and conditions should also say that they will refund most or all of your fees (less maybe a modest administrative fee) even if it is you who cancel provided they are able to fill your spot. 

Roberta Olenick
www.neverspook.com

If a workshop company cancels a workshop you should get 100% refund - period - in fact there should be clear guidelines up front on how long out a company can cancel etc. Otherwise they can make it up as they go along - which seems to be the case here. FWIW We specifically instruct people not to book flights until a workshop is confirmed for this reason.

Anything less than a 100% refund under the circumstances is UNACCEPTABLE. In fact if you were instructed to book flights I'd be asking to be reimbursed for that too.