NEC spectraview and web images

[Joan CT]

Some weeks ago I purchased a NEC Spectraview 2690. And, for sure, that's a really nice monitor. I can see some colours never seen in other displays (specially those in between blue-rose-violet you can find in some Orchids).

But I'm finding a kind of problem :

I shoot RAW and adjust the final image in the Spectraview with Lightroom and (if needed) PS CS3. But the images that i see perfect (let me use this term for this example) in the NEC, they apear totally washed, dark, and with a big loss of contrast and colour in the normal-office displays.

Let me show you an example. This is a leopard in the Serengueti last week.

I would really appreciate your oppinions on how do you see it and any suggestion that you mind can halp with the work with the new screen.



Best,

[c.w. moynihan]

I have the NEC 2690 with the Spectraview II calibration package. Can I assume that is what you have ? Is the monitor calibrated ?
Bottom line for me, in order to view sRGB converted images correctly on the web, you need to do two things:

1) tag the image with it's color profile during the save for web process.

2) View tagged image in a color managed browser (Safari or the latest Firefox). Viewing an image whether tagged or not in Internet Explorer is never going to look right since it is not color managed. The images, in my case always appear oversaturated when viewing them on the NEC wide gamut monitor using Internet Explorer or if they are not tagged and viewed in any browser. So I am currently undergoing the long process of re-doing all of my web images so that they tagged with the appropriate color profile, which for me is sRBG for web images.

For future web posting and on my web portfolio, I mention that the image is best viewed with a color managed browser. As long as the image is tagged and the viewer is looking at the image with a color aware browser, you can be assured that the colors are being seen as you intended (As long as the viewers monitor is calibrated).

[accwai]

It probably has nothing to do with profile juggling this time. I just looked at the leopard image on my 2180WG LED and it's still very dark. The monitor was calibrated using SpectraView II and the image was viewed using Firefox, Photoshop and the Windows 7 preview, all of which as color managed. Brightness level on the SpectraView default photo editing setting is quite high if I remember correctly. What brightness level of the OP's monitor set at right now?

Andy

[c.w. moynihan]

I am looking at the image with both IE and Safari on a calibrated normal gamut monitor here at work. There is very little difference in appearance on both browsers which says to me, the image is not color tagged. This may not be the issue of course. The image does appear dark to me.

[accwai]

When I was looking at the image at home earlier in the morning, I believe Photoshop says it's sRGB. Can't double check now believe I'm at work. In any case, I think it boils down to this: if the OP would open the downsized web image in Photoshop on the 2690 and it's dark, then there is color management problem somewhere. But if the web size image looks the same as the original on the same screen, then that screen might be too bright.

Andy

[Joan CT]

Thanks a lot for your inputs.

- Yes, the monitor it's a NEC 2690 with the Spectraview II calibration package.
- I didn't calibrate it. I assumed it comes calibrated from factory. Am I wrong ??

And, also, I think there is something more than web and browser items :

At home I work with a MBP and the NEC as a main monitor. I adjust the image in the NEC and when finished it appears similar in NEC and MBP screens (more briliant and with a redish cast in the MBP). Then export it with Lightroom converting from ProPhoto to sRGB. After that, when I open the image with the iView it appears completely dark. And the same happens if i send the image to work and open there with a non calibrated office monitor with PS CS3.

Once again, I will really appreciate your oppinions and advice.

Best,

[c.w. moynihan]

Thanks a lot for your inputs.

- Yes, the monitor it's a NEC 2690 with the Spectraview II calibration package.
- I didn't calibrate it. I assumed it comes calibrated from factory. Am I wrong ??

And, also, I think there is something more than web and browser items :

At home I work with a MBP and the NEC as a main monitor. I adjust the image in the NEC and when finished it appears similar in NEC and MBP screens (more briliant and with a redish cast in the MBP). Then export it with Lightroom converting from ProPhoto to sRGB. After that, when I open the image with the iView it appears completely dark. And the same happens if i send the image to work and open there with a non calibrated office monitor with PS CS3.

Once again, I will really appreciate your oppinions and advice.

Best,

Yes, you need to calibrate it. Plug in the usb color meter, pull up the spectraview software and select a luminence/brightness value of 110 cdm2 for web images and follow the prompts. There will be no user interaction required during the calibration process (ie: like having to adjust the monitor's brightness during calibration like you had to with the old xrite calibration package). I will almost guarantee that's why your image looks so dark. Prior to calibrating, I would make sure the monitor has been turned on and warmed up for at least 1/2 hour. Also make sure you tag the images and view them in a colored managed browser like I discussed in my early reply.

[Joan CT]

Many, many thanks Christian.
That's the firts thing I'll do today after work.
I was living in a dream. I was completely convinced on the factory calibration and ready to use.

Best,

[c.w. moynihan]

Yes Joan, once calibrated, the software will remind you that a calibration is over due after a period of time...2 weeks I believe is default. The nice thing about profiling with the NEC, is that you can save various luminance targets (Profiles) and pull them up at will. One can have a target for 90 cdm2 for better print matching when printing, then quickly switch back to 110 cdm2 for the web image processing for example.

[accwai]

I was completely convinced on the factory calibration and ready to use.

Brightness, gamma and color temperature all affects the values in the internal LUT. If I remember things correctly, the monitor come from factory with brightness full on. That's likely the reason why your image looks dark everywhere else. As soon as you turn it down or change the other settings, you need to recalculate the LUT.

The other thing is the SpectraView software reads the screen one last time after hardware setup is done. The monitor profile file used by Photoshop and others is generated in this last pass. You're running without a monitor profile until you do your first SpectraView calibration run...

Andy

[accwai]

[...] The nice thing about profiling with the NEC, is that you can save various luminance targets (Profiles) and pull them up at will. One can have a target for 90 cdm2 for better print matching when printing, then quickly switch back to 110 cdm2 for the web image processing for example.

Hmm... Can the 2690 really handle 90dc/m2 properly? On the 2180WG LED, screen contrast, color temperature accuracy and color tracking accuracy drops drastically below 100cd/m2. And the 2180 is RGB LED backlight so it should in theory be able to handle low luminance better than CCFL backlight. But the 2690 is a lot newer so they might have improved things in this area. Still, it would not hurt to compare the numbers on the info screen between 90 and 110 and make sure things are still holding up Ok at 90cd/m2.

Andy

[Royce Howland]

Even if a monitor was calibrated in the factory, all monitors drift. One major reason for this is that the LCD backlight will grow dimmer over time. It's recommended to recalibrate periodically as Christian notes, usually once or twice per month. The other issue is that calibration does involve making some value judgments about how you want your monitor set up. There's no way another person can make the best decision for you. There are some recommended rules of thumb, e.g. gamma 2.2 is pretty much a standard. Most people target D65 (or 6500K) as the white point, but not everyone does; some prefer targeting more towards D50 for a warmer display that may offer a better match to natural light print viewing conditions.

And as Christian also notes, the luminance target you select may range between ~90 cd/m2 (for print matching) to 110 - 120 or cd/m2 (for matching to conditions under which others may be viewing your image on the web). But your luminance target also depends on your work room's ambient lighting conditions. A low luminance is fine in dim conditions, if your monitor can handle it... I believe the NEC 2690 should handle 90 cd/m2 okay. But if the room is very bright (and you can't darken it at all) then you may wish to calibrate the monitor to a brighter setting so you can make out details.

Once you have your NEC calibrated to a good combination of recommended target values and values that work for your purposed & ambient conditions, then you can start considering the match between it and other displays...

[c.w. moynihan]

[...] The nice thing about profiling with the NEC, is that you can save various luminance targets (Profiles) and pull them up at will. One can have a target for 90 cdm2 for better print matching when printing, then quickly switch back to 110 cdm2 for the web image processing for example.

Hmm... Can the 2690 really handle 90dc/m2 properly? On the 2180WG LED, screen contrast, color temperature accuracy and color tracking accuracy drops drastically below 100cd/m2. And the 2180 is RGB LED backlight so it should in theory be able to handle low luminance better than CCFL backlight. But the 2690 is a lot newer so they might have improved things in this area. Still, it would not hurt to compare the numbers on the info screen between 90 and 110 and make sure things are still holding up Ok at 90cd/m2.

Andy

90 cmd2 looks good to me, but what should I look for when looking at the 110 cdm2 #'s and comparing them to the 90 cmd2 #'s ? Blackpoint values, ect ?

[accwai]

[...]
90 cmd2 looks good to me, but what should I look for when looking at the 110 cdm2 #'s and comparing them to the 90 cmd2 #'s ? Blackpoint values, ect ?

Backpoint is one. Or more conveniently, you can use the contrast ratio. Off the top of my head, the 2180 has contrast ratio of close to 300 at 100cd/m2, but that drops to a bit above 200 at 90cd/m2. That isn't a big deal for print matching though. In fact, it might even be desirable.

The more important ones are color temperature and color tracking. At 100cd/m2, color temperature is off by 20 somewhat degrees. At 90cd/m2, it's off by 70+ degrees if I remember correctly. And on the curve screen, you can see the accuracy of color tracking. At 100cd/m2, it's like a 0.3dE and 0.6dE average with and without dark tones and something like 1dE maxi deviation at the darkest region. At 90cd/m2, my recollection is 0.6dE and close to 1dE average with and without dark tones and maxi deviation at the darkest region is around 2dE.

Now of course, even at 90cd/m2, it isn't like the end of the world. But color performance has decreased significantly. One might decide to accept it after all is said and done. But at least be aware of it. For myself, softproofing in Photoshop at 100cd/m2 is very accurate. So I've decided that's dim enough. In fact, I use this brightness level for print and web without switching around.

Andy

[c.w. moynihan]

Thanks Andy. That will help me to delve deeper into the issue. I will report back to this thread when I get a chance to review the calibration results on my monitor.