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by KK Hui on Thu Apr 29, 2010 6:48 am
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I've had the 7D for just over two months now. As far as BIF tracking I have a mixed feeling for it. I use single AF point for tracking flying bird that is small in the frame. If the bird is fairly large in the frame using all 19 AF points is fine. Single AF point with expanded tends to go to bg if bird is small. Also initial AF acquisition is not fast and reliable in this configuration as I found out; I even tried using the 'pumping AF' technique but to no avail. For all the above cases AI Servo Tracking Sensitivity is set to Slow (not medium slow). In the end I just use the center AF point in AI Servo mode for most BIF shootings now. Actually I was getting good result with 50D AF tracking using just the center AF point for BIF. So in this respect I'm not gaining much with the 7D despite the great specs it has on paper. :(

For fast BIF shooting I've gone back to my aged 1D2 which beats both the 7D and 50D IMHO. I often use all 45 AF points in my 1D2 (covering a larger VF area) for tracking fast small birds with excellent result. :D
The 7D has failed me in the AF tracking department and I'm truly disappointed! Imagine using just a single (usually the center one) AF point for tracking a small fast flying shorebird with erratic flight path ... almost impossible, right?!!! Since I don't do video with my 7D anyway I may sell it after all. The ultimate as of now for the job would probably be a 1D4 for me.
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by liquidstone on Thu Apr 29, 2010 7:20 am
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Sorry to hear that the 7D's AF doesn't work well for you, KK. Mine works well enough that I sold my previous BIF workhorse (1D2) after using the 7D in a couple of BIF sorties. I wonder if there's some copy variation AF-wise..... have you tried another copy of the 7D? BTW, my default AF points for BIFs is center with expansion and tracking sensitivity at default. It can usually pick out the BIF even against terrestial BG.
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by KK Hui on Thu Apr 29, 2010 7:29 am
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Thanks for your feedback, Romy!
Unfortunately I don't have another 7D to try. The incapability of AF tracking using my 7D is more pronounced when shooting fast small shorebirds. The 7D just don't seem to be able to keep up compared to my 1D2. :(
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by Kari Post on Thu Apr 29, 2010 8:58 am
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I'm still figuring mine out (only 3 days of use so far and its currently being borrowed), but I like it. There are so many AF configurations that I haven't really found what works best yet. I did find that I had a higher percentage of sharp keepers when shooting at the Alligator Farm this past weekend at the Florida Birding & Fotofest vs when I was using my 1D2N there last year.
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by E.J. Peiker on Thu Apr 29, 2010 9:49 am
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Hmm, I found it to be slightly superior to the 1D2n for tracking.
 

by DonS on Thu Apr 29, 2010 9:58 am
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I have been using my 7D last Oct. I previously had a 1D2 and a 50D. For me, the 7D AF has been clearly better than those two cameras. And the 8 fps nearly matches the 1D2.

Having read many of the posts regarding the 7D over these many months, I have some points to share.

1. The AF system is a very advanced system. With 19 AF points and 5 AF modes and choices within each mode, it takes time and study to learn how to optimize the AF system to different situations. Each person is different and what mode and set-up works for one person may not be the best for another. Patience and study and learning are the keys to success with this AF system.

2. Adjusting both the AI Servo focus tracking and the AF Focus search "speeds" will affect your results.

3. I began using the Zone AF system using the center zone. It has worked very well in many BIF situations. I have tried the AF expansion mode and single AF point mode. Both worked very well in specific situations. However, this was for me. Your results may be different. Have you tried each mode? I am looking forward to trying and learning the Auto Selection 19 point mode. Chas made a comment, when the 7D was introduced, about how useful this mode may be.

4. I use the LensAlign Pro lens/camera calibration system for my cameras and all AF lenses. All the camera companies provide the ability to adjust the AF of lenses and bodies today. For me, the LensAlign Pro system works extremely well, is easy to adjust, and is reproducible consistently. When I hear of people having AF issues, I always ask if they have tested the AF of their camera and lens. This may help their results. With the high resolution of the bodies today, they may be detecting (or show up) slight AF errors that previously we could not see. For example, I could place a slide on a light table and check it with a 10x loupe. In Lightroom, I can examine the pixel resolution far closer than 10X.

5. Having worked in a large camera store in the D.C. area for two years (a couple of years ago), I met people who would complain of a camera (any camera, any brand) and then learn that they had not read the camera manual. Or they would skim it and start shooting, then complain that their results were not great. I would examine their camera and find some setting that was way off. I would adjust it and then magically the photos would be great. My point is that I have read some people's complaints here on NSN over the past several months and it was clear that they did not read the manual, or understand it, and so of course the results were not optimum. The 7D manual is 246 pages. There is much to learn and understand. And the manual does not explain the reasons and advantages of each setting choice.

6. I recently was at Gatorland for three days. I got many great BIF images. And I had some misses. Clipped wings. Busy background and OOF bird. But the majority were very good.

7. Adobe is introducing ACR version 6 in Photoshop CS5 and LR 3. This is a new processing system that is superior for noise. This should help those who wanted less noise in their 7D images.
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by srfnson on Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:50 pm
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I've have the 7D and 1d4 as my main BIF bodies for the last 5 months and use to shoot with the 1d2n. I've been very impressed with the 7D shooting snowy, northern hawk, and great great owls this past winter. In fact I wouldn't hesitate to say that the 7D has been able to capture sharp images in similar conditions that the 1dm2n had difficulty in last winter.

For the past 2 weeks I"ve been shooting short eared owls against a dried grass field as the background. It's been one of the more challenging AF tests for both cameras as the owls blend in extremely well to the background. It's the first time I've been able to compare both cameras in the same conditions over multiple sessions.

I've been able to compare acquisition speed at different distances, tracking as the owl flies low and temporarily behind tall grass, and all point AF capability tracking 2 owls flying close to each other.The majority of my shooting is at centerpoint AF with expansion and standard servo tracking using the 600f4.

My conclusion is the 7D AF can keep up to the 1d4 in all but the most demanding situations. The 1d4 has the edge in low morning light with a low flying owl blending in very well with the grass a couple hundred yards away. The 7D took a bit longer to lock on and sometimes would lose af lock when tracking.

For most other conditions when the light is good I really can not see any significant difference between the 2 bodies. I've never had the 7D fail me, in fact it's been the other way around. I've had sequences that i thought I totally missed until I viewed the images in the computer and been pleasantly surprised.

Sounds like you either have a problem with your body or a problem with your settings.
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by ahazeghi on Thu Apr 29, 2010 2:10 pm
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KK,
You probably know my stance on this subject :) Don't waste your time.
 

by KK Hui on Thu Apr 29, 2010 6:37 pm
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Thanks all for the feedback!

I especially like to hear from people who shoot shorebirds in flight using 7D. This is where the AF system is put into stress to keep up with the most demanding situations. Shooting larger birds is not a problem and is an easy job in comparison. I believe I have the skills shooting BIF from all these years and I do read the camera manuals as well ... :lol:
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by Scott Baxter on Thu Apr 29, 2010 7:11 pm
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KK
I have been shooting the 7D from my kayak. Low light performance is poor but I have not had a problem with shore birds except in low light. I have been shooting a lot in overcast conditions lately and the dull neutral water exagerates the noise of the 7D, that has been my biggest negative. My settings are about what you say you are doing. It would be good if you could try another 7D to see if you have the same problem.
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by JKQ on Sat May 01, 2010 4:53 pm
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Hi KK

I have always admired your BIF shots and have no doubt you can optimize any camera. I just spent a month in NZ and spent a fair bit of time shooting, or trying to shoot oystercatchers, in flight. I had a 7D and a MkIV with my 500/4. There was no question that I had a way easier time acquiring focus with the MkIV, and holding on to focus with the MkIV. Any keepers of these little rockets came from the MkIV. I just could not lock on or hold on with the 7D. HOWEVER, I wonder if it is also a function of the magnification for me. Maybe my technique just cant cut it with a 1.6x sensor and small BIF?? Maybe the bigger field of view offered with the MkIV is the difference? BTW, I also resorted to using the MkIV + a 1.4x when I wanted the reach of the 7D... I don't know if the MkIV is up to everyone's standards, but it seems like it is a big step up in AI tracking from the MkIII and maybe as good as my MKIIN was..

Ken

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by KK Hui on Sat May 01, 2010 6:43 pm
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Thanks for your reply, Ken!
Your experience on the 7D echoes mine. As now my aged 1D2 is the AF tracking benchmark for me. The 7D just doesn't cut it despite its awesome specs on paper. The 1D4 sounds promising but I haven't had a chance to use one yet ...
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by Karl Egressy on Sun May 02, 2010 10:55 am
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I have been looking at your BIF pictures for quite some time, KK.
Based on the outstanding quality of your pictures, it is fair to say that if you have issues with the 7D, it is the camera and not you.
I returned mine after 11 days and bought a Mark IV.
I also heard from a friend, that a group of people who he shoots with, and have been known as fligh specialists, returned or sold their 7D for similar reasons that you mentioned.
It tells you something about the camera, not to mention the noise problem I had experienced.
 

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